So all of our barn members (5 of us) went out on a trail ride at a new local trail system in our county. Our newest border invited two friends, both draft horse owners (incidentally) from another barn to join us, so our group was 8 horses althogether. The breeds represented were 2 OTTB, 1 Morgan/QH, 1 QH, 1 Arabian, 2 Haflinger crosses, and a Percheron.

Halfway through the ride, the visiting draft contingent began to hold back their horses and then canter or trot to catch up with the others. This, of course, upset the two thoroughbreds and I turned around to reiterate that we had all agreed to keep to a walk as we had a less than fit horse with us and a timid rider in the group.

At one point, one of the draft riders, a self-proclaimed Hunter/Jumper trainer, had a habit of riding her horse, jigging, prancing, and snorting; with his nose level with my stirrup, causing my guy to tense and lay his ears back (he doesn't kick, but was certainly not okay with the situation). I offered her a place in front of me, which she declined.

 Shortly after, this lady suggested we switch up the order, and upon agreeing, the 3 drafts moved into the lead, and shortly after trotted off. This set up an explosive reaction in the two thoroughbreds, threatening to bolt and whilest trying to regain control, my horse began to back up, nearly pushing the Morgan cross right off the trail and over the edge of a drop off.

Obviously I need to work on my horse's reaction to others leaving him on the trail, and we will begin working on that over the next few months. We were able to avoid a wreck, but things could have gone horribly wrong in a matter of seconds.

Am I overreacting in not feeling comfortable with riding with these folks again? Was there some sort of communication line we could have taken to avoid this situation? I wonder if there was something else I could have done or said to avoid this situation. Any ideas or opinions? What would you have done?

It would probably just be best not to continue to ride together, and the draft horses should probably have started out in the lead so they could go on ahead when they got bored of walking.  It was a good training opportunity for your horse to deal with different situations and other horses, but if they made you nervous, it is probably best to hit different trails next time.  The draft horses are clearly more used to being on the trail, but the OTTBs could really benefit from learning how to deal with situations like this.  Did you clear the "walking only" before you arrived on the trail? I would be annoyed if I loaded up my horse and hauled him to go for a trail ride only to discover it was a walk only ride, especially if my horse was manageable and in shape.  You probably need to spend some time working on your horses responsiveness to you and get him more trail miles. I do not think, apart from getting too close to your horse, that the other actions on the part of the visiting riders was rude.  I have been on many trail rides where several people wanted to go slow and several others wanted to go on, it is your responsibility to teach your horse to be calm and responsive when something like that happens.

Yes, it is your responsibility to get your horse more "group trail ride" ready, but once ANY of the horses became upset--for any reason--the riders who had more tolerant horses should NOT have done anything else but a walk. It was their activity that caused the trouble for the other riders, and they should not have shrugged their shoulders and thought, "That's their problem." If you ride in a group, the whole group has to pay attention to the other members. Unless the whole group agrees that others can leave the group, it should not happen.

Oh I hate when people do that. I recently was taking a horse out for his owners foxhunting as a favor. He was an OTTB that had done CCI** eventing so he's quite powerful. I was to tag along with the wife who has a seasoned draft (coincendently) and give the horse a good first outing. We were doing fine until she started to do just what those people were doing, letting him fall behind then take off in a buck snorting gallop. I mentioned that it was making it hard for me to keep my horse quiet, as he would bolt and nearly run into her horse if she was ahead of us and simply pass all the others if he came up behind us.

I did my best to finish that ride (we were about a half hour into a 2 hr ride when this started) and was able to get him back to being quiet by the end - but we were galloping in place the majority of the time and lost a shoe at some point - not to mention downright dangerous over the panels and completely overheated. I have politely declined any further invites and explained very clearly why. It is simply dangerous for that woman (who is a self proclaimed expert) to ride her horse like that in a group - and I feel obligated to tactfully but unfalteringly explain that.

I'm in there with FCP.  I have been trail riding 52 years and I don't mean two hour hacks in the Metro Park.

I have no room or patience for rude riders and never hesitated to call them out on an organized ride.

Fortunately, for me, any group of 15 or less that I rode with were all long-time friends, we were seasoned riders and knew if we had to change up our game plan because someone was on a new horse.

That being said, there was probably some mis-handling of the situation on both sides of this thread:

I can easily see the rider of the Draft getting on the snot faced side and subtly trying to amp your horses up without really doing anything "wrong".

Conversely, as FCP said, there is a lot more training required not only on your horse's part but also yours so you know how to control a horse that gets excitable in certain conditions.

The horse won't learn to wear a "no-fear" T-shirt until the rider does and sometimes that is never 100%.  I have had one or two horses, down thru the years that I taught to dance-in-place.  Eventually they got tired of that and just stood quietly.

Don't get me wrong, I am the farthest thing from a "yahooer on horseback" that you would want to see, but I see mistakes on both sides of this fence that can be corrected.  If the Draft People make you that uncomfortable, make it perfectly clear to your other barn buddies that they are not allowed on the next ride.

There is nothing that say "great trail horse" like wet saddle blankets.  I am sorry, but all the de-spooking inside an arena isn't as efficient as getting the horse out on the trail and forcing it to face the real demons of the woods.  The very same flat rock the horse has passed 50 times over the summer, may send him into a dip and spin on the last ride of Fall - go figure - they can think but sometimes there is no logic to their thinking and that's where the human comes in:)

I have never sacked a horse out at home.  I put them on the trail and away we go; if I think I see the need, I have called up a couple friends with well-seasoned calm horses and said "help me out on this horse's maiden trial ride".

Since he was three my now 23+ TWH (in my avatar) will fearlessly walk up to heavy construction equipment when its running, go hoof-to-hoof with a P.O.'d male llama, and motor along side the state highway with semi's whizzing by and he never flicks an ear.  The bulk of that is who he is --- the rest of it is who I am.  We don't think about being afraid, we just "do it".

My other two are not like that, but I don't give them a chance to think about being spooky, I just start talking to them and tell them to keep moving.  That's where 48North's advice comes in --- keep that horse moving forward.

Well, I think it is certainly a good Idea not to ride with them again- but dont ignore them. If you for some reason have to ride with them again- ride another more mellow horse as those two riders will run off again.

Personally, I would not trail ride with them again.  I experienced a similar situation where myself and 2 others were on a 4-H sponsored trail ride riding clean up.  Our job was to pick up the trail markers and make sure everyone was off safely.  The people putting up the markers were on their drafts and wanted to make sure no one could tamper with them so as I was on my 16h TB and the tallest I was selected to kneel on my horses back and stretch up to get the marker.  About 1/2 way through the other two took off at a gallop, thankfully my TB is sweet enough and waited for me to get back in the saddle.

The way I handled this was to call the person in charge of the ride and explain what was going on.  I finished the trail ride with them, but made a point of making sure they knew they were no longer welcome to ride with me.  If you addressed and told them what they were doing that you felt wrong, then I feel you have every right to no longer want to ride with them.

I would personally call the person that invited them, express your concerns and what you are planning to do, and then call the people and explain to them what they did wrong, why you felt it was wrong and then explain for safety reasons you feel that it would be better that they refrain from future trail rides with you.

Having my first group ride in years last week, I can say that I think that happens with every new group.  Mostly there needs to be training on both sides.  Long strided horses need to learn to go a bit slower, the short strided horses need to lengthen a bit.  There needs to be communication between EVERYBODY....  In our group the paso wanted to gait, so the rest of us had our horses facing each other while that rider rode out for awhile, then came back to ride within the group again.  There was some trouble when I wanted to ride alone to go home, and the other horses wanted to follow, and some were upset that they were being left behind. 

Sassy definitely needs more training, but I have never said differently.  She did jig when left behind, and she did try to go home when she realized where we were.  She was unsure when nobody else followed her.  But everybody worked together to make sure everybody was safe.  If needed, I would have made Sass stay with the rest of the group.

If the people you ride with are not willing to communicate openly and clearly, I wold not advise riding with them again.  If they are willing to work with you to make the ride enjoyable for all, then let them attend too.  The group that I rode with is a well formed group, and there were only 2 newbies, me and one other lady.  We all had an enjoyable ride.

Hope everybody's rides are the same, enjoy what is left of our summer. :)

 it was just as if I wrote your letter..Know it alls cause injury,nervousness and plain ol bad riding memories and experiences. its hard enough to find the time sometimes let alone having to fight with your horse because others cause a panic.

I Had a friend who did the same exact thing..i mean even down too letting her horse ( a barrel horse) gallop up on me and my horse Bubba. I'm sorry i work 2 jobs and dont get to ride, nor am i as experienced as a barrel racer, but i do my best & my horse has come a long way (so have i)...

dont they get IT that when they do that "charging up, let their horses trot when their horses decide to trot etc)that they may be having fun but the horses in the front think "ok everybodys running and getting the hell out of here I must go too)..I know how you feel, no one hates barn drama more than me, nor do i like confrontation, i just wanna ride my horse, smell the air, talk with my friends or sometimes not say a word and take it all in..its because of selfish sometimes ignorant riders that have me exhausted with boarding and why I'll be bringing my horse home as soon as I can.I know not everyones in that situation so you have to make it as safe as you can for you no matter what.

Thank God no one got hurt, im sure some were P'ed off...I felt as you that I need to prove to my horse that he can trust me in all situations..this wasnt easy..I did however have to allow Bubba to join in the fun once and a while and have an agreed, approved Canter or Gallop once in a while, sometimes bubba got pissy when riders do that to us, sometimes he just wanted to have fun too, i believe he got tired of always being held back, i had to trust him, but when he immediately starts looking to kick those horses or try throwing his head or ive even had him buck he got so mad i needed him to trust me and i refused to ride with those type of riders..you can say hey im not telling you how to ride but in my experience this is what happens to other riders when you guys ride like that..you can say that you just wanna have fun too but when you ride like that you put me in danger and i just wont have it"..Its frustrating to the horse.

i believe in safety first..stunk for the timid rider as well because I'm sure you all encouraged her and insured her no one was gonna get crazy..I personally would of spoke that moment. I have learned if other riders arnt gonna give a crap about my safety or sometimes they just dont know any better, than what do i care if I hurt their feelings..when another rider tells me to please not to do something and follows up with the why they feel that way i have never said well screw you..I apologize and i probably just learned something i didnt know..I used to be the girl who always led the rides and i always let my mare trot when ever she wanted..i'd spent so many yrs on the trail with her, we made so many trails, miles and miles of trails that i was so comfortable and having such a good time i felt that if you couldnt control your horse thats your problem..until she died and i got another horse.a gelding this time whose an alpha..all of a sudden i was the girl having the horse that acted up..talk about Karma..lol..

I have been the one who had to get off my horse and work him on the ground to get his attention..i dont appreciate others causing me problems and since those that taught me how to ride sure told me when i making the situation unsafe for all its in everybodys best interest to say it as kindly as you can. once the lady who taught me the most forgot herself and let her horse run up on bubba. not once but quite a few times..she was nervous cause she hadnt ridden in a while and she was just picking her battles..until bubba kicked her horse and hit her on the leg..first thing out of her mouth was "sorry my fault carolyne i had that coming..the next thing she said was damn it my laziness caused my horse to get hurt"..i love her shes such an honest pete...

I did however work very hard at getting Bubba to trust me.I committed to 2-3 times a week of riding and ground work.my horse just didnt trust me and truthfully i didnt trust him either..Im so glad weve grown together.

Now others can gallop off without me and Bubba may not always like it and every once in a great while he might even have a little temper tanrum..But majority of the time he's such a good boy..such a good boy..

i dont wish anyone to get hurt..but if your being plain ol stupid its called a wake up call is needed and better you to bring it to their attention than your horse bring it to their attention..i followed up with "AND THATS WHY YOU DONT RUN UP ON OTHER HORSES"after bubbas kicked out..now i turn him to face them so it doesnt feel like a sneak attack and his legs are out of harms way.

horses from other barns cause big problems when your horses are used to riding with their own click..i had a friend who went to nevada for this big horse vacation where they did this insane long trail ride with hundreds of riders..i told her it wont be what you think..I wasnt trying to be negative nancy on her but i know how sensitive her horse is plus shes only had him a yr and hes BIG..16.3 big. she had the worst time..her horse went mental for a while..there were so many riders who had no trail ettiquette and all those strange horses just put her horse in a tizzy..by day 3 he was a gem..but the first day that 8 hour ride exhausted her..she was so tired she almost didnt go the second day..but she did and gomer was way better than the day before, the 3rd day he was a gem and the 4th day she stayed at camp lol.I was so proud of her.

Stay safe girlfriend..even agreeing with the ones your close with, the ones you really enjoy hitting the trails with that you dont ride with those other girls if you cant come to an agreement..let those crazys ride somewhere else or with each other somewhere else..you ride as you do RESPECTFULLY..Your so not over reacting

from one cowgirl to another..

carolyne

 

 I've been on quite a few trail rides, some fun ones and some not so good. I learned it was best to:

1) train your horse as much as possible for all contingencies

2) be very particiluar about who I went on a trail ride with because horses running off (crowding, or other behaviors) can get someone hurt.

I would always ask the group - and hold back at a walk, usually with another rider/horse, and then we'd canter to catch up. Or if there was a hill and I wanted to gallop to the top, I'd ask if they are ok with it. That gave them time to ask their horses to stop, or doing something else. I declined several rides with people as mentioned above -accidents waiting to happen, and did happen. "Trail manners" for EVERYONE is essential for safety for all riders and their horses. Otherwise it could end up being a frightening experience. Maybe you can find people who want to only walk and enjoy the scenery. No offense to casual trail riders but most are out for fun and don't give much thought to it. Serious trail riders train themselves and their horses and people with them, in how to navigate trails, stay safe and have fun. 

 I will suggest both "parties" could learn from this.

 

I mostly prefer to ride by myself.  I need to train and condition two horses for long distance riding and usually turn down "buddies" when on one horse but require them with my new one.  My code has been to tell my friends, and by that, their tag alongs, that I am training this ride. Having said that, if the pace becomes too slow I will tell them I am leaving.  A good and safe practise is to let them turn around, and go a bit down the trail, then I can proceed at my pace and they can turn back and proceed at theirs.  Same thing if they stop and you catch back up with them.  

 

Please keep in mind that while it may have sounded like a good opportunity for them to come along, if the drafts were becoming stressed by the pace they needed to move out.  They could have done it much more politely, it seems to me, but I've been there and needed to be gone.

 

As for the comments on the good this did in the training for the TB's, it is needed training, but little steps are safer.

 

Ask a group who persists in this to give you a moment or two to get far enough away that their move out doesn't upset your group.   It will be good for your newer trail horses to turn for home and then back away again, too.

 i loved your reply..especially loved the moving forward and teaching your horse to dance in place..you can sure tell someone whose been in the game many yrs..I bet you could teach us lots of things..moving forward was probably the hardest thing for me to do when i got my second not so calm arab quarter horse..but it was so good for his mind..our panic says "pull the reins and make'm stop"..thats bad..ive worked around trees, rocks, bridges what ever was available, something anything to get him thinking on something else..my friends horse loves to run..sometimes i go, sometimes i dont..depends on how my horse Bubba and I are interacting that day..I love the days i can go enjoy the wind in my face and I appreciate the other days when i give him a job instead..just wanted to say again how much i liked your reply..

carolyne

Well said ~

Be a partner with your horse and nothing else matters.  I have a draft cross (lol) and we ride with gaited walkers.  He wants to move out, and so do I.  They can't keep up the pace and he pushes them forward.  I've learned to hold him back. 

The ride within your group should be addressed and resolved before setting out.   Last summer, the entire group moved out, but I made my guy stay behind with a 70 year old lady on her arab, because she couldn't keep up.  My draft cross gelding turned into thoroughbred off the tracks and the next day my ribs ached from holding him back for an hour and a half.  It was a lesson we both needed.  On the one hand, I really really wanted to move out with the rest of the group and understood their desire to have fun, but on the other hand, I was amazed that they could leave the rider behind who was unable to keep up.  To this day I wonder if that's acceptable - I suppose if she never caught up they would go back to find her?

It would be lovely to stay within a safety net of familiar riders all with the same breed and temperament of horse but that's not always the reality.  Also, what if, while riding within your safety net, something spooks the horse in front of you and he bolts?  Your horse will typically follow suit unless you have trained him to use the thinking side of his brain.

 

lol

i liked what you said there.  Me and my friends went riding together and they wanted to canner all the way home and let me remind you that we were riding for a hour already and the horses were getting to that piont where they could care less and just wanted to be done and we were on are way home and well anyways the wanted to canner and i was one a 20 year old and even though we only had about a mile to go i didnt think it would be healthy for him well they didnt care and took off i was pretty upset and felt bad for the horses.  well my one friend didnt have shoes on her horses which i did not no or we wouldnt of gone riding in the first place because how bad the rocks were and her horses ended up stop and started lipin' and she didnt no why i look at his hooves and he had a rock stuck on his frog i took it out and looked at her and said you shouldnt have this horse your not using your brain and your pushing a smart horse to hurting hisself. And now ever since then she takes it easy with her horses and uses her brain.