Thanks Jcarot and CheyAut!

Thanks for explaining the bay and chestnut agouti and extension genes! Makes much more sense. Maybe the father carried the A+ gene...

Pictures of some Belgians today (from OK State)



It is true that the commonly seen Belgian is chestnut today. BUT as I said before this is an AMISH Belgian and therefore not affected by the trends of the horseworld. The fact that we are allowed to breed to the stud is an honor. The line was established in the 1800's. That is before the fad hit to have chestnuts with flaxen manes and tails pulling the wagon.

The quote used was a quote from the Belgian Review and was an advertisement trying to sell the Belgian as an easy to match horse for teams.

The truth of the matter is that the only horses available to breed from 1913 to 1937 were those already in the country, 1773 belgians were registered at that time (1910). WWII stopped the importation of new stallions (but by 1937 there 3196 horses registered). So the horses that were available to the public all got mixed together and yes, they are now a one color breed IN AMERICA overseas where there was a larger population to choose from and breed the Belgian is not all chestnut.

Quote:

---

In America, its color is usually chestnut or roan with white or blonde mane, tail and points.

---

Information supplied by the Belgian Draft Horse Corporation of America

To get the white or blonde mane/tail, what modifier must be present?

"Flaxen" is the modifier that gives the white mane and tail. Flaxen only shows up in Chesnut horses. It's not known exactly where it comes from or how to breed for it. Flaxen can range from a light brown to a bright white. Madonna has the chestnut/flaxen which is closer to white and both her parents had the flaxen mane/tail also. It can lay dormant for several generations and just show up. You never know when you might get it. Altho the best way is to breed two horses that are flaxen. Some breeds are known more for it... the halflinger is one, the other is the belgian.

Wrong.

Black is always dominate.
When you have a chestnut and a bay you have basically two possible combinations.

The chestnut is two chestnut genes and may hide agouti (pretty pointless here since the bay has agouti)
The bay is either a chestnutXblack genes with agouti or blackXblack with agouti.

Since black is always dominate if the bay is BlackXblack then the foal WILL be black based. Either black or bay (depending on weither or not agouti gets passed on).

If the bay is chestnutXblack then the foal could be chestnut, black, or bay (agouti).

Can't be dun, grey, or roan b/c neither of her parents are soooo BAY is my final answer, lol. She certainly is a cutie pie!!

I'm guessin bay

Thanks!

Thanks, I guess that explains why with the limitted studs the majority of Belgians went chestnut.

The reason I was wondering about the A+ was I was on horsecolor.com and read this:

Quote:

---

A+, which is dominant over all the other alleles at the A locus. It is called "wild type" bay, and gives a much lighter horse with shading that makes them look much lighter on the underbelly, and the black on the legs is much less extensive (perhaps only up to the ankles). Some books specify the color of the Przewalski's Horse as an example of this gene, but pictures of them show that they are actually dun. Perhaps they are A+ and dun, both. It is possible that this gene was once the most common color in all horses, but has been almost completely bred out of the modern horse population.
...
Currently, the various Agouti genes are believed to affect only the eumelanin in the horse's coat, and therefore would have no visible effect on a chestnut horse, which has no black pigment to be affected. There are some who believe that the various A alleles may affect the shade of a chestnut, but at this point there is no evidence one way or another. Anecdotal evidence does suggest that black horses seem more likely to produce very dark chestnuts (liver chestnuts) when they do have chestnut foals, and vice versa, so there may be something to the idea. However, the one study that was done by the researchers who isolated the a allele showed no statistically significant difference in the shades of chestnuts whether they were AA, Aa or aa. Hopefully more research will be done in this area soon.

---

But what do I know?

I can't help with the color thing but wanted to say what a beautiful foal you have.

Can't get any more bay then that!

i think she will be the same color as her mom

Bay roan. Have any updated pictures of her? I am wondering how Belgian and Arab would turnout. Interesting cross.